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Ahmediya and takfir; a thread.
The propagandists of this group are eager to attack others for "sunni supremacy" and are greatly offended at takfir against them. But they never address the virulent mass takfir in their own books. Read this thread to see:
The propagandists of this group are eager to attack others for "sunni supremacy" and are greatly offended at takfir against them. But they never address the virulent mass takfir in their own books. Read this thread to see:
Let's start with the founder of this group. Mirza himself. A "prophet" in their view. They call him the "Promised Messiah" (this will come up in some of the below quotes)
The below pic is from Mirza, and on their *official* site. Clear takfir.
Source: https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Essence-4.pdf
The below pic is from Mirza, and on their *official* site. Clear takfir.
Source: https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Essence-4.pdf
Some people bring up earlier quotes in his career that are more conciliatory. Don't fall for it. Mirza also used to say there are no new prophets and any new claimant to prophethood is a kafir. He changed his tune later on. See screenshot attached.
Source: https://www.alislam.org/library/books/TheHeavenlyDecree.pdf
Source: https://www.alislam.org/library/books/TheHeavenlyDecree.pdf
His takfir should come as no surprise. He termed Muslims who did not take from him as "offspring of prostitutes". If you don't believe this is real, there is a second zoomed screenshot on their website, with the page number of the book boxed.
Source Url: https://www.alislam.org/library/browse/volume/Ruhani_Khazain/book/Aina_Kamalat_Islam/?l=English#page/547/mode/1up
Source Url: https://www.alislam.org/library/browse/volume/Ruhani_Khazain/book/Aina_Kamalat_Islam/?l=English#page/547/mode/1up
Now that we have their founder's (who is apparently a "prophet") view, let us turn to his 1st successor. Their first "caliph". Nooruddin. He was a close companion of Mirza. Here is his reply (2nd pic) to a question (1st pic). Page # is highlighted
Source: https://www.alislam.org/library/books/HazratMaulviNooruddeen.pdf
Source: https://www.alislam.org/library/books/HazratMaulviNooruddeen.pdf
Again, the takfir is clear, as is the question asked. Now let us turn to one of the sons of their "prophet". He was one of their major scholars. Mirza Bashir Ahmad. His wiki page is here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirza_Bashir_Ahmad
Source of the pic below where he takfirs: https://www.alislam.org/urdu/pdf/Kalma-tul-Fasal.pdf
Source of the pic below where he takfirs: https://www.alislam.org/urdu/pdf/Kalma-tul-Fasal.pdf
In the same book I just linked above he has another takfiri statement.
“...We find that the Promised Messiah has permitted us to have only that relationship with non-Ahmadis which the Holy Prophet Muhammad permitted with Christians”
See pic
Source; https://www.alislam.org/urdu/pdf/Kalma-tul-Fasal.pdf
“...We find that the Promised Messiah has permitted us to have only that relationship with non-Ahmadis which the Holy Prophet Muhammad permitted with Christians”
See pic
Source; https://www.alislam.org/urdu/pdf/Kalma-tul-Fasal.pdf
Next, let's look at their second "caliph". The successor to nooruddin. He was also another son of their "prophet". He has tons of takfir.
Reminder; "Promised Messiah" means Mirza
The next few tweets are screenshots of this book, "Truth About the Split": https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Truth-about-the-Split.pdf
Reminder; "Promised Messiah" means Mirza
The next few tweets are screenshots of this book, "Truth About the Split": https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Truth-about-the-Split.pdf
The page numbers are all visible for you to check
1st pic: he explains 3 beliefs attributed to him, then admits he agrees with these beliefs. One of those beliefs (#3) is mass takfir. Even those who didn't hear Mirza's name are called kuffar, outside islam!
pic #2: more takfir
1st pic: he explains 3 beliefs attributed to him, then admits he agrees with these beliefs. One of those beliefs (#3) is mass takfir. Even those who didn't hear Mirza's name are called kuffar, outside islam!
pic #2: more takfir
On this page, he quotes an article he wrote on a previous occasion, which earlier he said was approved by nooruddin (his predecessor, 1st ahmadi "caliph"). He says even those who believed in Mirza but hesitate in giving pledge (bai'at) are kafirs. Also forbids salah behind them
In these two screenshots he again reiterates takfir, but makes it very clear he had made this takfir before he was "caliph" and this was widely known even before he began his office as "caliph". He assumed the role of "caliph" in 1914CE.
Now we turn to another text that is by the same person (2nd caliph). Let me remind you, he is also a son of their "prophet"
He prohibits the funeral prayer of even non-ahmadi children. Compares to hindu children! Translation is in the 2nd pic.
Source: https://www.alislam.org/urdu/au/AU3-5.pdf
He prohibits the funeral prayer of even non-ahmadi children. Compares to hindu children! Translation is in the 2nd pic.
Source: https://www.alislam.org/urdu/au/AU3-5.pdf
In the same book he has again performed takfir. I've highlighted the text and placed a translation beneath. Again, page number is boxed for visibility.
Source is the same pdf: https://www.alislam.org/urdu/au/AU3-5.pdf
Source is the same pdf: https://www.alislam.org/urdu/au/AU3-5.pdf
Next, we have their official newspaper/magazine. "Al Fazl". This is the 7th Feb 1921 print of the paper. You can see the archives page here: https://www.alislam.org/alfazl/rabwah/archive.php
Source used for pics: https://www.alislam.org/alfazl/rabwah/A19210207.pdf
2nd pic is zoomed bottom-right corner of first + translation
Source used for pics: https://www.alislam.org/alfazl/rabwah/A19210207.pdf
2nd pic is zoomed bottom-right corner of first + translation
These are not fabrications. I have kept the page numbers visible in the screenshots and linked the sources back to their official website. I've done this for everything. Everything can be checked.
Next, the average ahmedi today says everyone who utters shahada is muslim. They seem to reject any kind of takfir for anything. Now if an ahmedi tells you he considers sunnis as muslim he is very likely being honest. Most lay ahmadis are ignorant of all of the above texts.
Their layman generally do not takfir others, these quotes are hidden or interpreted away.
Later on Mahmud Ahmed and others, when in a problematic position due to such takfir, claimed it was not takfir! Using logic like "by kafir we do not mean non-muslim"
Later on Mahmud Ahmed and others, when in a problematic position due to such takfir, claimed it was not takfir! Using logic like "by kafir we do not mean non-muslim"
Even if such a nonsense explanation was accepted, besides the word kafir, the words "not muslim" and "outside the pale of islam" have been used. So even changing the definition of kafir does not work.
If ahmedis still claim they never did takfir, the reply is nobody has ever done takfir on the ahmediya, since "kafir", "kuffar", "outside the pale of islam", "not a muslim", "pukka (confirmed) kafir" and comparisons to Christians and Hindus is not takfir according to you!
To reiterate I have established clear takfir from:
* Their founding "prophet"
* Their "first caliph" who was also a close companion of their founder
* Their "second caliph" who was a son of their founder
* Another son of their founder who was also one of their major scholars
* Their founding "prophet"
* Their "first caliph" who was also a close companion of their founder
* Their "second caliph" who was a son of their founder
* Another son of their founder who was also one of their major scholars
I'm going to finish off this thread by noting that the corrupt beliefs of this heretical group does not justify mistreatment or violence towards them.
Additionally many of their laymen are incredibly ignorant of this stuff (I'm speaking from first hand experience).
Additionally many of their laymen are incredibly ignorant of this stuff (I'm speaking from first hand experience).
