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THREAD: Aesthetics and Efficiency
When most people chat about aesthetics and efficiency, they're always mutually exclusive. I've seen this many, many times on the TL. People rarely mention them together because when they're both there in high levels it means a player is clear.
When most people chat about aesthetics and efficiency, they're always mutually exclusive. I've seen this many, many times on the TL. People rarely mention them together because when they're both there in high levels it means a player is clear.
The GOAT debate seems to provoke this line of discourse particularly often. It's usually used as part of an argument for the GOAT case of Cristiano Ronaldo 'he's so clutch and effective' in comparison to Messi. This is a blatant falsehood and let's explore why.
Cristiano's effectiveness isn't a falsehood just to be clear, he is effective. He has a ridiculous number fo matchwinners and his UCL KO stats are enviable. The falsehood is assuming that a player is less effective BECAUSE he's more aesthetic.
But Messi has arguably been the most effective forward of the last 15 years. Certainly since he hit his peak anyway. The guy didn't win 34 trophies, 30 of them as main man without being ridiculously effective. He's second only to Cristiano in UCL KO goals despite having played
in a deeper role since 2014. He also had more matchwinners than Ronaldo in 4 of the 9 La Liga seasons in which they shared the same league, an amazing stay considering he played consistently deeper than Cristiano from 14/15 onwards.
Messi has scored in 2 of the 3 finals he's played in (one against Cristiano). He's scored more goals in finals than any player in recent memory. His conversion rate was always higher than Ronaldo's save for the odd season and he had a better goal per minute ratio as well
as a superior career goal ratio despite taking far less shots and playing in a consistently deeper role since 2014. Cristiano was only consistently deeper than Messi from 03-06. That's it. Cris has played consistently closer to goal for the best part of 6 years now.
And that's only looking at goals. Messi has more tools than Ronaldo to impact a match. His passing range is superior, his ability in tight spaces is superior, his ability to create angles is superior, as is his dribbling, close control, vision and reading of the game.
When we look at effectiveness in terms of goals as the only barometer, Cristiano is unquestionably one of the most effective players ever. But even here, Messi competes with him and even surpasses him at times. Now, when we extend what we mean by effectiveness
to include playmaking attributes then I'm afraid a chasm begins to form. Their head to head records show this. Cristiano's goal record here is comparable of course, but Messi's playmaking stats in their head to head clashes absolutely thump those of Cris.
This is not only just looking at assists, by which Messi has 13 compared to Ronaldos 1 in H2H clashes. Here are their playmaking stats in Clasicos. This was compiled in October 2018 which makes it fair as Messi has played more since and Cris left just prior to this.
I've lost count of the amount of times Real Madrid were sliced open by a Messi throughball. But that's anecdotal and as much as I would love to wax lyrical about throughballs, everyone knows about my obsession with them, let's stick to the main argument.
Now I'm not saying that Cristiano hasn't been effective at creating chances for his teammates. He has been. His 16/17 UCL campaign is testament to that. But compared with Messi since both hit their peaks, it isn't close.
Keep in mind that Messi scores as many goals as Cristiano at a superior rate in many contexts, save UCL KOs and international footy (Messi has long played in a deeper role for Argentina, even before 2012, yet even here his goal ratio is only marginally worse).
As Messi scores as many goals as an amazing scorer like Cristiano, it's absolutely mind-boggling to see him thumping the best playmakers of the last 15 years as well. I always say stats don't do playmaking justice, but these are quite comprehensive.
Alright, alright, we have to talk about throughballs here. LOOK AT THE GAP. Players like Xavi, Iniesta and Ozil are here. Masters of the playmaking art. And yet in the pass that most requires the player to have excellent vision, timing and weight of pass, Leo is so clear.
Messi is IMPOSSIBLE. He tops the playmaking charts against the greatest creators of his generations AND has a better scoring ratio than the greatest scorers of his generation? What a FREAK.
This paragraph beautifully sums up why Messi is **arguably** the most effective player of all time. From a fantastic statistical analysis on Five http://ThirtyEight.com of Messi's 2014 World Cup, called 'Lionel Messi is Impossible'
Here are their respective MOTM awards over the last decade as well as their average match ratings.
I would like to see the MOTM awards between them without goals or assists. That would be even more damning. All of this isn't a slight on Cristiano, he's one of the GOATs for sure, and he's supremely effective and intelligent. But Messi is just on another planet man.
